Teaching kids to invest and think smart about money

I know a lot of adults that are doing what they can to teach kids about investing and saving money. The most common way is the good old fashioned piggy bank.  There is something to be said especially with younger children to putting some change in a piggy bank.  It is a good start but it is also quite limited.  With the good old pig you always can open him up and raid the savings and the savings lack any type of leverage.  You earn no interest and little Johnny’s or little Dorothy’s pennies end up worth less ever day, unless they are solid copper that is.

My view is it is important to have kids open their first bank account as soon as they are old enough to grasp the concept.  A Roth IRA with some monthly contributions should be set up by age 12 and money should be discussed from a positive outlook.  Don’t teach your children things like, “money is the root of all evil” as that is not the proverb anyway.

People that do well with money come from homes that discuss and value money.  Now of course you must teach ethics, family values and over all life lessons as well.  Your kids shouldn’t worry about money or believe it is the end all be all.  Yet they should understand it and its power, both good and bad and you should teach them the Building Wealth Philosophy as early as possible.

One of my favorite books for parents helping kids learn to invest is Rich Dad Poor Dad for Teens The Secrets About Money–That You Don’t Learn in School!  To me this book is an absolute must read.

One way or another make sure you are making things like money, avoiding toxic debt, savings and investing positive topics of discussion with your kids.  I am not saying your kiddos first words should be leverage and interest over mamma and dada but you get the point.

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More on investing in copper pennies

Heck why not one more post about pennies. Yesterday I did a pretty long post extolling the virtues of pre 82 pennies as a simple and small investment. Again I want to restate this isn’t a “way to get rich” but it is a really cool and fun little inflation hedge and about as risk free and low cost as any form of investing has a right to be.

Anyway I found a really cool little resource that reinforces my point that 95% copper pennies that are still in circulation are a pretty hot little item to set aside right now.

The site is called CoinFlation and I have put it into my book marks so I can always find it in the future. One of the coolest tools is a coin melt value calculator that tells you the exact value of coins when you melt them down. They have two calculators one for silver coins (pre 65 dimes, quarters, halves, etc) and one for coins currently in circulation. To give you an idea of how “valuable” pennies made prior to 1982 are. I decided to run all the comparisons at a 100 dollar face value. So lets look at some of the out of circulation silver coins that you can’t find today out side of a coin shop, some of today’s other coins and their “real value” and then compare them to the humble copper penny. Of course this is “raw

• 100 dollars face value of silver dimes, silver quarters or silver half dollars is worth $1017.81 at today’s current metal prices. They are all the same because each represented a fraction of an ounce of silver as in 1/10th, 1/4th, 1/2 ounce etc. So these coins represent about a 917% return of investment just in metal value for those who had the forsight to pull them from circulation in the 60s, 70s and for a bit of the 80s when they were still around.

• Now if you took 100 dollars worth of today’s quarters you end up with about $18.33 in raw metal value or an 81.7% “instant loss”.

• How about 100 dollars worth of today’s pennies (anything minted after 1982) you get a whopping $58.80 in raw value or a 41.2% “instant loss”.

• What about 100 dollars worth of Kennedy Half Dollars? Everyone loves those right? Same formula as the modern quarter. Melt em down and you get $18.33 in raw metal value or an 81.7% “instant loss”.

• What about the nickel? There is a lot of copper in a nickel and it is a thick coin so it does ok. Try a raw value of $113.75 or an instant return on investment of 13.7% Perhaps storing nickels ain’t a bad idea either?

So how does our humble penny add up against all this? Today’s metal prices for copper and zinc put the value of 100 dollars in pre 82 pennies in raw metal at $193.61. That is easy math an instant ROI of 93.61%! Sure the penny isn’t currently holding pace with those old silver coins and it will never catch up to them. As copper goes up you can bet silver will to. Yet that is my point you can’t just go around picking up a dozen silver dimes a day any more but you can pick up a good amount of pennies from prior to 82.

Sure even with copper at say 5 - 6 dollars a pound you would need a lot of pennies to be worth even say 10,000 dollars. Yet just think about it, each day you sort and toss some into a jar. Painless and foolproof, what do you have to loose other then a bit of space?

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Double your money in the metal market with no investment

Ok, hold on, don’t get to excited. Indeed I am going to tell you exactly how to get an almost immediate 2 fold return on your money. I am also going to show you how to do it with out spending any money, hiring a broker or even with out doing any paperwork. However, I have to tell you right up front you are not going to get rich with this technique.

In fact this technique is first and foremost fun to do, second it is designed again to program you mind in how you think about words like “money” and “value” and finally last it is about actually making/investing money.

Now that big lump to the left is a chunk of raw copper. Copper has skyrocketed in both price and demand over the last ten years. Copper is used in countless industrial activities and as countries like China, Indonesia and India continue to modernize the demand will continue to grow and often to out pace production capacity. This issue will be compounded by the boom in coal, gold and silver. Consider that you are a mining company and you are choosing where to go and what to do next. You can either mine coal which is far easier then any metal or you can mine silver or gold which is worth far more then copper. Or last you can mine copper which is profitable but if you had the option what would you mine?

Great! So how does this help you double your money with out spending it? The answer is in the humble penny. Currently and since mid 1982 all U.S. pennies are made from mostly zinc with a copper cladding, basically a zinc coin with a very thin layer of copper on the outside. Such pennies are worth damn near nothing from a metal stand point. However, any penny that is older then 1982 is 95% copper and 5% zinc alloy. What does this mean? Let’s do some math.

Step one - When you look at pennies that are made from 1981 back they are heavier then today’s. In fact there are 146 pennies to a pound. Yet we must consider that such pennies are only 95% copper so 1.05 x 146 = 154 pennies make one pound of pure copper.

Step Two - 154 pennies even those from 1981 back are “worth” in currency a whopping $1.54

Step Three - Copper is currently trading at the time of this writing for $2.84 per pound. Hence 154 pennies are “worth” $2.84 in raw copper and copper is a commodity you can actually sell it for very close to the current spot price.

Step Four - Calculation of our return by simply dropping an 1981 or earlier penny into a “special” jar or container is as follows. $2.84 - $1.54 = $1.30 of “profit”. Now take you profit of $1.30 and devide it by your “initial investment” of $1.54 and you have a “instant return of investment” of 84%. Not quite double but as soon as copper goes back over 3 dollars a pound (which analysts believe will be quite soon) and you are at a full 100% return.

We should also consider that copper was trading for about 60-70 cents just 20 years ago and you start to realize just how high your “return” can be if you just start tossing all you pre 82 pennies into a jar for the next twenty years.

This is a great project for adults and kids alike. The bad news is again you are never going to get rich with this and in fact copper will have to go up to say 6 bucks a pound before you will really be able to “cash in” pennies in any real volume. The good news though is there is no doubt that over the years that will happen and because we are talking pennies not many people are making an effort to store away copper pennies.

In 1959 the U.S. stopped making the “wheat cent” and while most of those have been horded away by collectors from 1959 to 1981 100% of pennies produced in the US are 95% copper and virtually no one have really collectively valued them at anything more then one cent. That is 22 years worth of pennies still traveling around in circulation which means their are hundreds of millions of these pennies out there being spent every day. I always drop my pre 82 pennies in a jar and about 1 out of 5 tend to be pre 81’s. Over the years that is a lot of pennies.

So why do this? I mean save 4 dollars a month this way and you make about 4 in return and you have another 400 fricken pennies to deal with right? Short sighted my friend, the key is you don’t do very much to earn that return and most people are making less on their interest bearing savings accounts a month in America. All you do is follow my advice and “spend cash” and each day go through your pennies and drop any 81 or earlier examples into some special container. How much easier can “investing” be?

Just consider if in 10 years you had 15,400 pennies or $154 bucks. Those pennies if copper is at 6 bucks by then will be worth about get this, 600 dollars. Retirement money? Heck no! Just another little store house of money. Additionally while I never get to concerned with numismatic value because of how highly subjective it is there is another opportunity here.

See first let me warn you if you are currently thinking of buying 200,000 or so pennies from a bank, sorting them out and melting the older ones don’t do it! The U.S. Government will frown on that and possibly make you wear some silver bracelets and break a few rocks for a few years. Such activity is illegal for now anyway. Yet as copper keeps going up (and it will) sooner or later the mint will begin to “retire” the old copper. That is a nice way to say they will take the pennies out of circulation and harvest the copper for use. Of course the government is free to do that. This will make a lot of these 60s ad 70s pennies harder to come buy and add some numasmatic value to them as well.

That is many years into the future but let me ask you this. How cool would it have been if say your grandfather started collecting 1964 and earlier silver dimes for you when we stopped making them in 65? For about 10 good years it was easy to pluck silver quarters, dimes and half dollars from circulation. Today it is very rare to find one. I happen to own a huge pile of such coins put away for me by a very smart grandparent. This led to my love of silver in the first place. Today we have the opportunity to start doing something like that for our children, their children and possibly their children’s children. What would 100,000 Indian head pennies be worth today?

There is more at work here though tied to the production of pennies and the metal price. Do you know why 1982 was the year that the penny changed to a zinc core? In the early 80s all metal prices spiked for a while and even then a penny was worth more as copper then as a penny! So zinc was a cheap alternative and coating it in copper kept the penny looking like well, “a penny”.

Today though even zinc is rising in price and it costs about 8/10ths of a cent in raw metal to make a penny. That is before production costs, etc. This means the US Mint is Loosing Money to make pennies. Additionaly so long as people spend cash we can’t get rid of the penny we have to have something in order to make change of a dollar with. I predict therefore that the days of the humble Lincoln cent are numbered! The easy solution is to come up with coin made of something perhaps even cheaper then zinc and make it smaller too.

Since no vending machines take pennies there is no problem with changing the size of the penny. Don’t think it can’t happen either, they did it with the dollar coin. When sooner or later this change occurs it will be another numismatic bump in the value of all pennies and even more so to the all copper variety. So I encourage you to take the phrase, “save your pennies” with a new vision. Start plucking the little copper disks from circulation today and just put them away.

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Getting rid of the poverty consciousness

This post is an extension of my post on, not resenting people doing better then you from a few days ago because that is also part of a “poverty consciousness” but today I am going to go deeper into this concept that I call financial cancer. So what is a poverty consciousness? In short it is the belief that money and wealth are scarce. That you have to be lucky or crooked to become rich and that cheaper is always better.

Now given my blog URL is CutThatBill.com you would think I would be all over the “cheaper is better” philosophy but I am not. There is a place for it,

• When it comes to a mortgage get the lowest rate
• When it comes to phone service pay the least
• When you buy a car negotiate the lowest sales price you can

In essence when you buy a specific item of a given quality there is no reason not to pay less if you can. Unfortunately this is not how most of the psychologically broke thinks.

I remember the first time I went back to the little coal town I grew up in after having built a successful career and life. I was going to go off on my own and do some fishing and stopped by a local donut shop for a coffee and a couple of old fashioned donuts. I was going to grab them and go but decided to sit down and enjoy my breakfast because I was on vacation and had all day.

Being alone and just browsing at a paper I heard quite clearly all the conversations around me. One word was used over and over by the mostly elderly crowd in their chit chat. That word was “cheaper”, this was “cheaper” here, that was “cheaper” there, Joe was a crook because his gas was two cents higher a gallon that at Tony’s where it was “cheaper”.

I got up and left, I just couldn’t listen any longer. Cheaper, cheaper, cheaper it was like being subjected meat grinder. While I fished that morning for small mouth bass with the sun on my back enjoying life though I realized that I used to be exactly the same way. When I lived in this town I remembered driving to Tony’s Gas Station to save the 2 cents, (5 mile drive in a car that got 10 miles to the gallon). I remembered all of it and I realized it wasn’t success that shed this constant “cheaper” search from me it was getting away from a culture married to it.

I can’t blame the people of that town, specifically the elderly on “fixed incomes” it is a poor place that never really recovered from the depression back in the 1930s. In fact my Grandfather used to say, “the Great Depression came, then it went, we never noticed.” Yet what I realized is this mentality of poverty is a big reason why my town is still poor to this day. The people all think they are poor, they expect to be poor and so they are.

After that day I realized much of this mentality was still in my head. I had shaken some of it off but not enough. I was still limiting my vision of success, of retirement of what I could expect to gain in life. I was still driving exta miles for pennies off a gallon of gas. Today I use the gas station on the side of the road that is best for when I need to pull out back into traffic.

I was still standing in supermarkets evaluating which package would have me pay less per ounce, today I buy the size that best fits my needs. Indeed even though I had money, even though I had started to build a second business and even though I was saving for retirement and paying off debt I was still on some level the poor kid from that coal town.

I believe most Americans today are still carrying their own “coal town” poverty mentality with them. It is what makes you limit your dreams one day then the very next day be stupid about how much you spend the next. Believe it or not this poverty consciousness is why people buy 50K dollar cars when one half the price is much better suited to their needs and budget. The expensive do dad makes them feel rich even though they are cash poor it helps them run from the fear or poverty.

On the other side they do things just to be cheap! They buy a 9 dollar garden hose that is kinked and useless in a year. They buy the cheapest refrigerator and it wastes electricity. They think a guy that makes 20K more a year is “rich” until they get there too and then they think the next guy 20K further up the food chain is rich.

This all stems from “poverty consciousness” if you see yourself as poor you will figure out a way to keep yourself poor. If you always look for cheaper, cheaper, cheaper then you will always have the poorest and cheapest things in your life. You will cheapen joy, you will cheapen your personal value and you will cheapen your dreams. Try not to use the word “cheap” as a positive thing.

Save cheap to describe junk. Save cheap to describe bad service. Save cheap to describe a stingy miser. Save cheap for negatives and use terms like “good value” and “excellent price” when you find a lower cost on a good item. This is just one step to removing the poverty demons from your subconscious but it is a good start.

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Pay the right price for you home

This post is not about setting your budget for a mortgage, taxes, insurance, etc. That is a number you need to come up with before you start even looking for a home. You need to determine what you can afford then follow this golden rule, SPEND LESS then you can afford.

What this post will do is help you find the right home for the right price with in your means. So let’s begin.

First, write down what you want this includes,

• What area you want to live in
• Your price range
• Bedrooms, Bathrooms, Garage, etc

The typical things you are looking for in a home.

Second, start to form your own idea of what is available in your area. Cruise over to Realtor.com and search properties. Drive the neighborhoods you are interested in and get prices on the houses with signs in their yards. Do your home work before you speak to a realtor. Visit new model homes, get pricing on everything. Learn what homes are like just above and below your target budget. If you are going to spend about 150K, then look at homes in the 90-250K range. Learn your market before you even think about spending a penny. Take as long as you need to do this well. Write down homes you could see yourself buying and see how long they take to sell at their price point.

Third, call a few different real estate agents (get referrals if you can). Talk to at least three, tell them exactly what type of home you want to buy, the neighborhoods you want to look it and the schools you want, etc. Be very specific. Tell the agent that you know about the phrase, “buyers are liars” and find it offensive! (I will explain buyers are liars at the end of this article). Then ask the agent what price range you should expect to have to pay to get that type of home.

In other words DO NOT let your agent start the whole interview by asking you what you can afford, you tell an agent you have a 125-150K budget and odds are you will find yourself in a 160K home! Remember you now know your market and you should get a number back from your agent that matches what you already know. Many times the number is much higher and this tells you that your agent is NOT LISTENING TO YOU, they are not understanding you. In many instances they are therefore not right for you.

Never let your agent call the shots control the relationship from the get go. They are experts, they are supposed to know more then you your preshopping will tell you if that is the case. Just because they know more then you does not mean they know what you want. Never let an agent say crap to you like, “you don’t what this” or “you really need to consider paying a bit more”. My accountant knows more then me, my financial advisors do to. Yet they work for me and are employed at my pleasure, I do not let them forget it.

Your agent may want you to sign a buyers agent contract. Never sign one that forces you to buy a home via them, one that protects you from going direct to the seller is fine. So is one that requires that if you buy a house they show you that your work with them on it but stay away from those that want a 180 day exclusive agreements. Explain you will be fair, that you want the right place for the right place and will give them the time they need to get the job done. Yet be clear they work for you and reserve the right to fire them at any time.

Fourth, choose the agent you get along with best that was at least close to the price range you expected to hear when you answered the question. Now take your maximum budget (lets call it 150K but it could be anything based on where you live and your income level, etc) and cut it by 10%! So that would in our example mean down to 135K and now your mission is to find a home that compares well with others selling at 150K. You can ALMOST always do this. Not in every market and not all the time but in most instances you can always find a deal like this.

Fifth, when you find the home you want to buy make your offer at least 10% below the asking price. So on this 135K home you now offer about 123K! All the seller can do is say no, you can always offer more, what do you think is going to happen? Do you think they might be so offended as to raise the price to 180? The only risk is someone else will buy the home. So what you must be willing to walk away from any deal. Most times when you low ball at precisely 10% the agent on the other end “gets it”, they generaly counter offer in the middle some where, you just might get that home worth 150 that is listed at 135 for 130.

There are always deals

Such deals are possible and in fact anyone can get one! I have done it on the last three homes I purchased. I bought one for just 84K and sold it for 109K just two years later with no improvements other then a deck. I bought another for 135 that was appraised at 159 and sold in three years later for a few pennies under 200K.

My latest find was a house easily worth 170 that was listed for 139 and I paid get this 120! How come, the listing agent was an idiot! The home had a second living area, a huge yard (1/3rd of an acre average lots are 1/10th), and a home office. The listing agent listed the house as a 3 bedroom, 2 bath, 2 car garage home, brick and vinyl. Nothing more! The guy should have been shot but it was my gain, we offered 115 they countered at 120 and I jumped on it.

The owners were days from having to start paying a second mortgage and I got the place for a song. Honestly there wasn’t another house with all of this going for it under 200K with in 10 miles of it but the buyer had to sell. The house was on a culdesac so it got no drive by traffic and the agent clearly blew the marketing.

So there you go a blueprint for finding the best deal on a home. Will it work in those white hot markets where houses sell in 24 hours? Not usually but generally just outside of those areas there are deals just waiting to be had. Be flexible, consider your options and spend LESS then you can afford. With a little work you can really get a great deal and build a solid investment from day one. Just remember real estate is not a game, you are not in it to be nice or make friends or even help people. You have to be tough, stand your ground and walk away if you need to.

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